智游城

标题: 有人知道些内幕吗？Chinese Cheating at Poker Stars [打印本页]

作者: dly163 时间: 2010-8-6 00:43
标题: 有人知道些内幕吗？Chinese Cheating at Poker Stars
Chinese Cheating at Poker Stars

A large scale Chinese cheating ring has been discovered operating at the PokerStars' $52 through $108 Double or Nothing sit & gos from the summer of 2009 until February 2010. PokerStars have already agreed to pay $587,000 compensation to those players affected by collusion.

Things started to unfold in public when the user Jane0123 appeared on the 2+2 forum complaining that his account on PokerStars had been unfairly frozen with $10,000 in it. Jane0123 got an icy reception, one user responding, "Ya finally got busted huh? Well it's about time. I sent about 25 emails complaining about you ****ing clowns." Jane0123's Sharkscope data showed that he had played 11,766 DoN's with an average stake of $87 and a profit of $56,300.

It soon became apparent that many of the suspected cheaters dominated the DoN Leaderboard on PokerStars. The nickname wudiyg was the site's biggest winner at DoN games in 2009 with a profit of $96,000.

The total sum won by the suspected ring is somewhere around $750,000. Often half of the players in any given game have been part of the ring, most of them coming from the Chinese town of Hangzhou. Several dozens of players are involved.

Users on 2+2 accuse PokerStars of not acting as decisively as they could have in investigating the cheating. However, the company have started paying compensation to affected players. Approximately $85,000 in cash or FPP have been confiscated from the cheaters, but since the total sum to be paid is $587,000 at this point, it's obvious PokerStars will have to pay most of it themselves.

Many players are not happy with the compensation promised or already paid to them. The user Simplicity8 says, "I've played about 7000 $52-$108 dons in the first 6 weeks of 2010. I kind of felt like something was up, but I assumed I was a losing player and just gave up. If true, this makes me pretty sick as they have not only just stolen money from me, but they have taken away future earning power from me. I was on a pretty nice pace to hit SNE (Supernova Elite)."

According to some calculations, the cheaters have generated $600,000 rake to PokerStars. While users on 2+2 admit that DoN's are an easy target for colluders and such collusion can be difficult to detect, others say that the cheating happened on such a scale and duration that PokerStars' security should have put their sensors up much sooner.

Investigation is still ongoing, but many suspect that so is the cheating possibly by another group of Chinese players. In recent weeks a lot of players from the Wenzhou area in China have joined the $52 through $108 DoN's on the site.

作者: mirkorocky 时间: 2010-8-6 00:56
请问这个消息是哪个网站发布的？

作者: FreeFree 时间: 2010-8-6 08:26

Things started to unfold in public when the user Jane0123 appeared on the 2+2 forum complaining that his account on PokerStars had been unfairly frozen with $10,000 in it. Jane0123 got an icy reception, one user responding, "Ya finally got busted huh? Well it's about time. I sent about 25 emails complaining about you ****ing clowns." Jane0123's Sharkscope data showed that he had played 11,766 DoN's with an average stake of $87 and a profit of $56,300.
mirkorocky 发表于 2010-8-6 00:56

如果没记错的话，这段的事儿在2+2和另外一个中文论坛里贴出过，印象里Jane0123好像还是个MM呢，她跟了许多贴来着。后来忘记继续关注这事的动向了～～～DON很容易作弊么，怎么作弊呀？从来没打过。

作者: darkillermax 时间: 2010-8-6 09:33

如果没记错的话，这段的事儿在2+2和另外一个中文论坛里贴出过，印象里Jane0123好像还是个MM呢，她跟了许 ...
FreeFree 发表于 2010-8-6 08:26

Don的话因为没有奖金差别，获奖名次又比传统SNG多，有点类似Satellite的打法。所以在bubble和准bubble时期，如果有2~3个人合伙的话那优势是特别巨大的。我只举两个例子：
1，A和B两人串谋，A在chip leader，B是short stack，只要两个人的位置很近（一般来说也不会太远，如果只有6人的情况，两个人的相对距离最远也就是3，中间隔着2个人，基本上chip leader可以用各种方式把筹码倒给short stack，最后两个人都熬过bubble，顺利拿钱。。）
2，还是A和B，A有大牌，B也是大牌，这个时候两个人就可以通过商量来制定打法，至少俩个人不会火拼，如果能夹住一个人就更好，做得好的话根本留不下什么痕迹，这个就是传说中的sandwich。。

如果配合好的话我觉得2个人其实优势要比3个人还大一些，因为考虑到3个人的buyin成本是2个人的1.5倍，但是实际上10人DON的话只有5个名额，只是3个人的风险能小一点而已。

作者: maomaobiao 时间: 2010-8-6 10:33

Don的话因为没有奖金差别，获奖名次又比传统SNG多，有点类似Satellite的打法。所以在bubble和准bubb ...
darkillermax 发表于 2010-8-6 09:33

其实这种是非常简单的“作弊”，我很早之前就设想过这种方法，仔细想过以后发现只有 DON 2人配合才具有一定的可操作性，没什么意思。资金实力不够雄厚的话也容易留下马脚或者被封，还是算了吧。

作者: runyutong 时间: 2010-8-6 11:18
我天朝人才辈出啊！！！

作者: bwzy 时间: 2010-8-6 11:46
差不多两个月前说那件？？？

作者: buhuilikai520 时间: 2010-8-6 22:52
还好不打don 。现在don难混了

作者: xiaogangqiang 时间: 2010-8-6 23:03
看不懂！

作者: yoking 时间: 2010-8-7 05:42
这就是我以前提过城里的周赛采用平分钱圈方法，容易产生作弊的原因。

作者: idle 时间: 2010-8-7 06:02
牛人到处都有呀。。可惜做的不够完美

作者: taoljj 时间: 2010-8-7 08:46
PS已经把封掉的那些账户的钱分掉了，可以说这个风波已经告了一个段落。

目前PS的DON已作了修改，同一地区的玩家不能坐在同一桌子，防止作弊（不知是否只针对国内玩家）。

这个事件，应该是少数作弊的带害了其他玩家，国内大量的玩家被举报，让PS不能不行动起来。

但是对国内玩家一刀切的做法，PS很不厚道，大多数打DON的玩家都认为PS没有能力和精力来认定一群打DON的玩家是否在作弊，以账户在盈利还是在亏损作为认定这个账号是否在作弊的主要原因，个人觉得非常可笑。

作者: shmily 时间: 2010-8-7 11:13
希望不会影响到Poker室对华人的态度

作者: shmily 时间: 2010-8-7 11:13
希望不会影响到Poker室对国人的态度

作者: kaimilove 时间: 2010-8-7 11:53
提示: 作者被禁止或删除内容自动屏蔽

作者: taoljj 时间: 2010-8-7 18:01
你要什么证据？

作者: kaimilove 时间: 2010-8-8 05:14
提示: 作者被禁止或删除内容自动屏蔽

作者: taoljj 时间: 2010-8-8 14:51
你分到钱当然觉得客服很同情达理，但是另一个分到几k刀的牌友也同样认为PS对DON密谋事件没有鉴别能力，这和分没分到钱没什么关系。既然你说到Aceking828，他刚好是我哥们，我和你同样认为他没有作弊，但是他的账号一直被PS调查审核中，我正是看到了PS发给他的信，才觉得PS缺乏鉴别DON密谋的能力。

作者: kaimilove 时间: 2010-8-8 22:32
提示: 作者被禁止或删除内容自动屏蔽

作者: AceKing 时间: 2010-8-9 14:13
ls的同学和我交手过么？我哥们说的是我以前的帐号仍在调查中。你可能打得不算多，事实上在今年初那次风波中，绝大部分20.8-104级别中国籍reg都被封号调查。我相信真正作弊串通的只是一小部分人，大部分人都是安分守己的在打牌。don本身制度的缺陷造成作弊的易发，而很多复杂情况的牌例很难判定牌手的出发点是否公正。从这一点来说，ps的安全部门的确缺乏don专业性的审核调查能力。回到你前面说的ps通情达理，我也同意你的看法，从总体来说，ps应该是各个方面都可以给玩家提供最好环境的平台。但是对国人的差别对待，don事件还是反映得比较明显。这也不能给ps戴上种族主义的帽子。很多事情我们自己的确应该反省，不仅仅是扑克道德，包括多帐户，刷红利等等很多国人玩家还在乐此不疲的行为正不断影响着我们整个群体的声誉。don事件已经告一段落，今后国人玩家不能同桌，有能力的自然会继续打，成绩再好也不怕引起非议甚至被冤枉错杀，本来靠串通才能生存那些害群之马自然也会逐渐消失。风波总算可以消停，只是造成的恶劣影响已经无法抹去。

作者: shooterz 时间: 2010-8-9 15:49
DON 108的温州男。。。这么厉害的数据。。。如果是作弊得来的，就有点太恶心了

作者: skizzik 时间: 2010-8-10 00:44
我个人的看法是这些中国牌手绝大多数都没有故意去作弊

但是比如另一个账号他认识，也是中国人，在圈边的时候往往会有比如“都是中国人，让着他一点就算了”、“中国人不打中国人”之类的心态。

可是这样一来，整个中国群体相对整个大环境而言，就产生了相对优势。那个人DON的ROI是4%，就赢了十万美金了。如果不让这点，比如要是因为不让而变成了ROI 2%，那不就少了5万美金么？

作者: meumi 时间: 2010-8-10 06:59
本帖最后由 meumi 于 2010-8-10 07:02 编辑

發表一些看法:
1. DoN相較於傳統SNG / Cash Game更容易入手,  很容易就訓練出一批人出來(甚至是訓練一批下線來打fpp)
2. pokerstars don $1 到 $100 也才 6個級別,  每個像樣一點的grinder都是同時開個10~20桌, 同桌有兩個以上的中國人很常見.
3. 佛山 Stud幫、 NL25 sss (allin or fold)集團,人數也不少, 為何被舉報那麼多次而還沒封號? 一定是做到誠實打牌讓ps無話可說.
4. 真的要怪的話, 作弊的那幾個老鼠屎錯在6成以上,  ps 調查人員無法分辨don作弊成員 2成,  2p2 那些敲邊鼓的外國人也給個兩成吧.

作者: yxzhiyoucheng 时间: 2010-8-16 22:27
作弊的空间很大，但不知道她是不是真的作弊了。

作者: pokerlv 时间: 2010-8-20 03:44
肯定是作弊的

欢迎光临智游城 (http://zhiyoucheng.co/)